Comments on: Uncertainty, Neuromodulation, and Attention http://neurodudes.com/2006/05/30/uncertainty-neuromodulation-and-attention/ at the intersection of neuroscience and AI. Wed, 20 Aug 2008 19:44:44 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.6 By: Bill http://neurodudes.com/2006/05/30/uncertainty-neuromodulation-and-attention/#comment-3787 Bill Wed, 31 May 2006 03:37:47 +0000 http://neurodudes.com/2006/05/30/uncertainty-neuromodulation-and-attention/#comment-3787 I'm with Dan on this one. I can kinda get behind the idea of dopamine as a signal for reward prediction error, but only really as a metaphor for what it is actually doing (signalling which synapses to strengthen and weaken). If noradrenaline signalled "unexpected uncertainty" then wouldn't stimulants like cocaine/amphetamine, which release huge amounts of noradrenline, leave people feeling unexpectidly uncertain? ("Man that last line of blow was so good, but for some reason, I feel very unsure"... maybe not quite). Furthermore, what would the physiological consequences of uncertainty be? Also, I don't understand how "Acetylcholine signals expected uncertainty". Striatal cholinergics, as far as I am aware, behave just as dopaminergics do, in regards to the RESPOND to unexpected rewards, or initially the cues that signal a reward. Though in the case of striatal cholinergics, there response is to STOP firing. But then I see the author is talking about the cortex... might wanted to put that in the abstract there buddy. :/ I’m with Dan on this one. I can kinda get behind the idea of dopamine as a signal for reward prediction error, but only really as a metaphor for what it is actually doing (signalling which synapses to strengthen and weaken). If noradrenaline signalled “unexpected uncertainty” then wouldn’t stimulants like cocaine/amphetamine, which release huge amounts of noradrenline, leave people feeling unexpectidly uncertain? (”Man that last line of blow was so good, but for some reason, I feel very unsure”… maybe not quite). Furthermore, what would the physiological consequences of uncertainty be?

Also, I don’t understand how “Acetylcholine signals expected uncertainty”. Striatal cholinergics, as far as I am aware, behave just as dopaminergics do, in regards to the RESPOND to unexpected rewards, or initially the cues that signal a reward. Though in the case of striatal cholinergics, there response is to STOP firing.

But then I see the author is talking about the cortex… might wanted to put that in the abstract there buddy. :/

]]> By: Dan Dright http://neurodudes.com/2006/05/30/uncertainty-neuromodulation-and-attention/#comment-3767 Dan Dright Wed, 31 May 2006 00:32:18 +0000 http://neurodudes.com/2006/05/30/uncertainty-neuromodulation-and-attention/#comment-3767 I am sorry, but I cannot resist the similarity to one of my favorite Rumsfeldisms: As we know, There are known knowns. There are things we know we know. We also know There are known unknowns. That is to say We know there are some things We do not know. But there are also unknown unknowns, The ones we don't know We don't know. —Feb. 12, 2002, Department of Defense news briefing Nice post; do you really think that the mechanism is that cut-and-dry, however? Curious to know your thoughts. I am sorry, but I cannot resist the similarity to one of my favorite Rumsfeldisms:

As we know,
There are known knowns.
There are things we know we know.
We also know
There are known unknowns.
That is to say
We know there are some things
We do not know.
But there are also unknown unknowns,
The ones we don’t know
We don’t know.

—Feb. 12, 2002, Department of Defense news briefing

Nice post; do you really think that the mechanism is that cut-and-dry, however? Curious to know your thoughts.

]]>